4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

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Revo2Maxx
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4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by Revo2Maxx »

Ok so there is some info that I feel needs to be addressed. 1 as I have said in the past the ability for the NVR like my 2116-HS to be turned off and not know it by Remote is bad for a Security CCTV system. Reboot I am all good with that option I have said this in the past I am just revisiting the issue but there is more..

When working in the 4216E-AI and my 7108-AI Recorders there is kind of a cool option when working inside a large Recorder and want to see more channels when working in the WebUI of the Recorder.. When you log in to the Recorders WebUI and then click on the Live View you can bring up say for this a 6ch camera view as a main window. Now lets say I want to View my Recorders 9ch View like I have on my NVR or NVR's GUI, on the right bottom area is some more window options I click on the 9ch view and it now loads that view in my WebUI (Picture Below)

Why this matters? Well now that I have clicked this 9ch view (Lets say I gave access to Visiting friend) that was a Bad person in mind. While in this view the person can see my screen and everything that I do on my Recorders GUI over the computer WebUI connection.. This means if your looking at a channel maybe not intended for them to view or adding a camera or just inputting the password for a camera not loaded yet or intended for them to use your mouse action is able to be seen as if it was you running the mouse yourself.. The thing is once you make this connection all actions on the Recorders GUI is in that window you have setup on your view on the WebUI..

This picture below is a 6ch view on my 4216e-AI, the 9ch in the Main ch area is from clicking the 9ch on the bottom right of the WebUI once done all actions can be viewed Even if you were going to change the password to the admin account you have them on so they can't access it anymore they will be seeing the change as you make it...
23.06.2021_16.19.48_REC.png
23.06.2021_16.19.48_REC.png (897.96 KiB) Viewed 10712 times
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by Revo2Maxx »

Good news for me anyway I was doing some more testing and found that while it will load the window to display the Playback feed it will error out and say on the WebUI unable to load and still play in the recorder GUI just fine once the person in the GUI goes back to camera view be it 1ch or 9 or 16 that will load back in just like what is showing in the picture above..
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by Revo2Maxx »

So another thing that I thought I better mention that I found while setting up after a Reset.. If you did a Factory Reset of the NVR, then logged into the WebUI to setup cameras because of the ease of use of a Keyboard for entering passwords after a reset you might be Dis-appointed here's why..

Logged into my NVR after fulling Resetting my 1046EW-AI camera and also Reset the NVR.. When I logged into the NVR I used WebUI to Populate the NVR with the 16 cameras. Ones that are loading from Front side use the same Password as the NVR by default for what ever reason the NVR don't work this way with the Back Side (POE Ports) they load in with admin admin.

So you have setup your system, All cameras are loaded and running, including the Reset POE cameras that are on the POE ports.. You want to make some changes to the camera so you log into the camera using the NVR Virtual Host, when you first log in your prompted to change the password (Even my 2014 POE Samsung Camears requires this) so you give it the Normal Password you have setup for your cameras, you then go into the NVR and change the password for the camera in the NVR's Cameras list and again it pops up in your cameras View.. Then after a day or so thinking all is well your system either does a Weekly Reboot if setup or you did a Reboot for what ever reason and when all the cameras on the front side populate you notice all the screens with wrong password, Now from the NVR's GUI you have to go back in and change all the Passwords again using the GUI Virtual Keyboard so the NVR will retain the Passwords for the cameras connected to the POE ports..
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by Revo2Maxx »

Guess I need to start taking notes of things I find I don't like about the 4.0 software incase I start to repeat myself..

So One of the things I just noticed after doing a Reset today and adding some cameras. I like the idea that cameras with same Password will auto start within the hardware HOWEVER 1 thing to note about that..

If you try to add a camera after logging into the WebUI of the NVR and do a search and add of the cameras on the WebUI it will not Auto load or add the password it is like your adding a POE camera and loads the camera with admin default password. What a Pain in the back side.. Heck one of my cameras ended up having to turn off the camera and NVR before it will load after adding the right password to the setup.. Trying to just log out and back in the NVR still resulted with camera saying it was locked out lol..

So I thought ok lets try this again. Reset the NVR again what joy lol.. Loaded the first few cameras over the NVR GUI and again with the NVR and cameras having same Password the cameras come online without issue. Load in NVR to the WebUI, go to cameras, device search, find a camera that has same password as the NVR add it, and shows orange dot. Click pencil and change password for that camera in the NVR and camera comes online so it is a thing that happens to more then 1 camera and more then 1 start..

Next anyone have the NVR that uses the WebUI for viewing and accessing PTZ cameras? Now the 4.0 software like the new FW for the cameras and DVR's will auto log you out this I know but has anyone noticed that you will get locked out of the NVR's access of PTZ functions before your logged out of the Recorders? Or is it just mine?

Here is what I mean. Log in NVR WebUI, accessing menus and storage and looking at live view, then going back to doing other things all while making sure to stay logged in. Then after a Set time I see something I want to PTZ one of my cameras the PTZ comes up with error and you have to log out the NVR and back on for it to work again? While I don't buy the idea that my cameras are Old Tech and that is why it does this. I know my 850EB's are old Tech, however it locks out all my PTZ or PT cameras be it Ash21, 841, 941, 1051 841v3 I mean is there something I am not figuring out or is all my hardware just TO OLD of Tech lol.. I have never noticed the 2116-HS do this to me when I am logged into that NVR's WebUI..
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by Revo2Maxx »

So here is something I felt I should kind of touch on little more..

Little before I mention that while on WebUI when using the extra display doing so will change the DVR or NVR into that display and that people can then see what your doing from the DVR/NVR GUI Well there is another part I found out and feel people need to be aware of..

While on my Mobile Phone, if I click on the 7108-AI DVR and then click either Zero-0 (Channel) or Zero-1 the DVR opens in that view then anything that I do over the DVR will be seen on my Mobile Phone. *Why that might matter below. So then I thought ok lets check my 4216E-AI and sure enough if I click on my Zero Channel to view in my Amcrest View Pro app, The screen on my NVR changes to 16ch view then again anything I do on the NVR will be seen on the Phone as long as they don't go off the zero channel..

* Why this matters or might mater.. Well for me, I have a lot of PTZ cameras that some are setup with a Password for access to the OSD. Because I am the one that sets up the PTZ cameras for the Tours, presets or even setting up the Motion Tracking Schedules if there is someone that hacks or has my info for my DVR/NVR and uses that option they now have an insight to what I am currently looking at and or could watch me enter the password of something they might not have the info for to start with... Also if someone wants to try and get pass your Security if they are on your Zero and can force someone to watch an event on say Channel 3 when they want to do something on another channel by having access to the Zero channel can give them that access

I am not sure all of the Devices this effects I know that it does for sure my 7108-AI and my 4216E-AI Recorders, I did log into my 2116 but don't see a Zero channel option. I looked in the GUI and WebUI but didn't see anywhere to turn on or off however that don't mean it isn't there, the Options are there on some of my other NVR's right now however they are in a Remote location and I have not been to the the GUI to see if it works the same way or not. I just know I have the Zero Channels on my WebUI and phone app for them...

Thought I would update my finding on some things found..

I find this option Suspect and dislike it the same as I dislike the ability to turn off a Recorder by Remote.. Being able to Reboot is 1 thing. Shut down shouldn't be an OPTOIN EVER...
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by jack7 »

Revo2Maxx,
I'm not a NVR expert and don't know all your operating requirements, but after reading your last post, could you solve some of the problems by doing the following things?
Turn off, unplug, or otherwise disable NVR monitor when you are not there.
Add app password in Amcrest View Pro for your trusted users.
Only use P2P for NVR access since you say it's secure.
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by Revo2Maxx »

jack7 wrote: Sun Aug 08, 2021 10:01 pm Revo2Maxx,
I'm not a NVR expert and don't know all your operating requirements, but after reading your last post, could you solve some of the problems by doing the following things?
Turn off, unplug, or otherwise disable NVR monitor when you are not there.
Add app password in Amcrest View Pro for your trusted users.
Only use P2P for NVR access since you say it's secure.
Interesting info.. The Funny thing is I tested this in both admin account and user account and you know what BOTH ARE BAD!!!!!! That is why I thought I might want to make light of the info so others that have these recorders can make sure they know who they are giving access to because both have the same issue... Maybe Just maybe if I hadn't said anything people wouldn't have used the Zero Channel to view the system and all this wouldn't matter!? However I feel if I find something I think is a Flaw and I keep it to my self and someone gets Hacked because they are using the same password for their cameras or what not I would have felt bad if I had known of the FLAW and not said something....

So do I want the Zero Channel to go away? NO I like the option of being able to see all 16ch in 1 window however it shouldn't be connected in the way it is... I mean on my 4216E-AI NVR there is no way outside of the Zero channel to see the Trip wire data and Person and Vehicle data that I can see using Zero Channel..

So I say P2P is Secure because unlike using Tinycam or some 3rd party software that Stores your password to access their software that isn't something that takes place in P2P... P2P is old Tech from Networking and stands for Peer to Peer.. There is a Server and in some cases maybe a few of them that gets a UUID PING and yes the UUID can translate into your SN, However that Ping is a Hello I am ready the server is then looking for a Client Ping that has a Matching UUID.. Once that happens the Server hands of the Client to the Device and the Client adds in the password.. THis info is in Encrypted data over a connection that is between your app and the device the server never sees any info no pictures no videos all that is 1 on 1 connection between your DVR/NVR or camera and the app on your phone or ASP if your accessing via ASP...
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by Revo2Maxx »

So ran the Firmware on it even though its the same installed already on the 7108-AI reset recorder, turned on zero channel and now not so intrusive. When I view zero channel it does change view on recorder and I choose ch0 when using GIU on recorder I can see the channel it goes too however the menu don't come up now and no longer can see main menu or my PTZ camera OSD. So that's good however no change on NVR can still see everything main menu and all.
Try to Avoid CCA Networking Cables They are JUNK PERIOD!
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by Revo2Maxx »

Ok for people that are reading this and have setup some users on the 4216E-AI NVR or other devices with this issue I have found a way to make this not happen.. So on this Recorder, When settings up the User even by Default with all play back and all Monitor it will work with Zero Ch however to cure this setup your Recorder to have a Channel that you don't want anyone to look at and remove it from the Monitor list. Then when they try to access the Zero Channel it will be Denied.. So far that is only way I found to make it so someone can't have access to your NVR menu from the app. Anyway I made a fast Video about it and what one needs to do to remove the Zero Channel from your users.. However if you need to have them with all channel access then they will have Zero Channel ability...

Also so Far I was able to test the 4108E-8p and it does have Zero channel function there is no connection between GUI and the App while using the Zero Channel... I am not sure about my 4108E-HS seeing it is on the West Coast..

Video can be seen here..
https://youtu.be/B9HEf903PmA
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Re: 4216E-AI and other 4.0FW Recorders

Post by jack7 »

Revo2Maxx wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 5:33 pm Ok for people that are reading this and have setup some users on the 4216E-AI NVR or other devices with this issue I have found a way to make this not happen..
....
Video can be seen here..
https://youtu.be/B9HEf903PmA

You apparently put the wrong video in your post above.  The posted video is about multimeter measurements.
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